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ryinc

Development Team Member
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Posts: 369
 #1 
Over the past few days, with a number of great data collections and Juerg's post on review of 2016 it got me thinking....

In between all the case studies, scattered across the forum,  different forum members have tried all sorts of experiments/assessments beyond 5-1-5 on their own or recommended by Juerg to more deeply understand the "live" feedback that Moxy provides. I would be really fascinated to come up with maybe 10 standard experiments that a few of us all agree to do and then share the data with each other. It seems there would be a lot of upside to me - we get to learn with our own assessments, and compare how person to person might be different. If we could get at least 5 people we could have quite a nice dataset. I think it could also be a useful way for new forum members to get quickly up to speed that there is more to Moxy than a 5-1-5.

Off the top of my head, i think we could come up with a few protocols to show:
  • Non-priority vs priority muscle
  • Respiratory changes - hypocapnic vs hypercapnic
  • Gravity experiments
  • Creation of venous occlusion
  • Symmetry/asymmetry
  • Differences between priority muscles - e.g. VL vs RF in cycling
  • Etc
Is there interest....or does it sound like too much of an effort?
juergfeldmann

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Posts: 1,501
 #2 
That is  the  way    people have to go  and I will look  from the side line and add ideas as this is what we  had  to go through many years back  when we had so many great new  questions. .  A great start is  to make it  simple in  some very basic  movements  to avoid  prob elms  with too many variables.
 . Example :
Start with a simple   isometric  biceps  contraction in a  90  degree  elbow position  and imagine a resistance so no  weight at all,. You  just concentrate on  try to bend the elbow but  you do  not change  position  so imagine  heavy weight and  do this  as long as  you can  and look at tHb  SmO2 live trends and look  or feel how SmO2  or tHb feedback fit  with what kind of a  feeling
  So fun to see the different results    from person to prosper  from complete  desaturation and a complete   arterial occlusion to any thing less than that including the recovery of  SmO2 in combination  with the  tHb reaction.
 Than repeat this  as a workout  by  starting the next isometric  load as  soon you either hit SmO2  calibration value , or  as soon  you hit a new  peak SmO2  value  ( overshoot )  or  wait  to see, whether after the overshoot you drop back down to a  calibration value. This is using SmO2 . Than you can  look at the same time on tHb reactions. 
ryinc

Development Team Member
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Posts: 369
 #3 
Juerg great, i will add this one to the list. Where we need further help with from you is more examples of the types of experiments to do (you have mentioned some others before but they are scattered across the forum).
juergfeldmann

Development Team Member
Registered:
Posts: 1,501
 #4 
Here a  initial start   people can try as  explained  above. This is a live  demo  we did  with John Williams in Atlanta in a MOXY  seminar  at his place.

Simple set up . Isometric   imagination of a  heavy biceps  curl.  There are different ways  you can learn  the interpretation.  Let's start as usual different . Most look at  SmO2  trend but I   like to start at  tHb  information. There  are many reasons  why  and the main reason is , that   for your next step to learn to use  live feedback  for  manipulation and planning of  physiological stimulation  tHB  has much more values.

This is one  surprising  point  for me, that  what ever company now  to try to jump in the  future training ideas on using  NIRS   jumps on   SmO2  values  to be used.
 Again  SmO2  %  is a  %  of  O2Hb  ( loaded  Hb )  of  the tHb  so a  change in SmO2  up or down  has to be looked in context  to tHb before we argue  that we have more  or less O2  available in the tested  area  and this still does not tell us  whether it is bio available.
Which really is strange, as  we have many  companies  on our  forum reading daily  what we  do  but  seem to have some limitation  to  actually  engage open on here  as there seem to be still some confusion , when I read advertising  of their  equipment. 

Here some key words.  why  tHb is so much more informative.

 Refueling of Cr.P  , Shuttle  of lactate,.  MCT 1  and MCT  4   stimulation, , Change in O2  dissociation curve  whether you like to  create  a hypoxia  hypercapnic   stimulation,  Change of bio  availability in O 2.  and much more.


 So here  our  small introduction experiment  we often started in seminars. and I love to start  with my  grade 10 - 12  students in  the local high school.

tHb trend   after   inan isometric  biceps  curl  with  imagination.

Howw many  curls. The timing  was  based on  subjective  ability  to sustain the load  or be ready to go again. So really a  individual approach. 

bi iso thb.jpg


How many  contraction ?. Before you read further  explain yourself  what you see or feel in each contraction


Now below  SmO2   feedback

bi isom smo2.jpg 
A
nd belwo  the  combination  with some short explanation  and  on what is the  explanation based on  and  if  you have the answer  you can see  why  tHB is  a  good  source of  information. Over time  you see in your mind  the biased  O2Hb and HHb  reaction so  try to imagine   how that would look like.
  Now   feel or imagine  what happens in the " Mind " of this  athletes in the  third  and  4 th contraction set.  look where you get the  interesting feedback  . ?

color.jpg

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